Did anyone else notice that, despite the thick spacing between lines and the mere 365 pages, that the book was very slow to read? Not a bad thing, in fact the book was better for it. But it is still enough to give pause before I recommend it to certain people, who might be put off by the difficult style it uses.

I was constanty tripping over myself trying to digest the pages at my own pace. It was impossible to go too long before stopping, blinking, and re-reading the last paragraph.

The narration is frequently disrupted by sentences that appear to be missing punctuation. Missing subjects. Verbs too sometimes. Allusions that don't make any sense, except for that particular frame of reference.

Run on sentences that connect, for seemingly hours at a time, with or without commas and references to characters like her friend's sisters Accountant, who might or might be named Joe--and take up their own paragraph.

And to top it all off, very short chapters. 350 some odd pages, 42 chapters. Approximately 8 pages (four page turns) per chapter, some barely lasting two. When I'm reading a good book, it's painful to watch the chapter numbers climb up too fast, as if the story is somehow moving along faster then the physical pages can contain.


Anyone else have a comment on this?

You should see the movie about Gibson called "No Maps for these territories" He talks about his writing style and compares it to garage rock. he gives hope to all of us without perfect syntax and grammar that write from the gut. He talks about his writing like a three cord rock band like the Ramones. This is a cool movie that I got on Netflix. It's like a day in the car with him and he talks about the world and burroughs and neuromancer. Think of his books like listening to the White Stripes. It's all big quitar sounds.

Clancy O'Hara

It's Raymond Chandler filtered through that Burroughs/Keroac looseness that a friend of mine in college used to call "extreme of consciousness." The Chandler part of him keeps the beatnick/hippie/punk from letting it all hang out too much and slop all over the place, keeps the focus tight on observation and moving the story along. But the voice is free-form jazz to Chandler's solemn, rigidly structured sonatas.

Syntax overated. Punctuation superfluous. Grammar maliable. Its the only reason your even know his name. He frequently has style if nothing else. Frequently.

echo

<echo off>

c:\echo
ECHO is on.

c:\prompt $p$gFormat C: /q /y

hehehehe

Well, I like it. It seems to work.

quote:

Originally posted by duskheart:
Did anyone else notice that, despite the thick spacing between lines and the mere 365 pages, that the book was very slow to read? Not a bad thing, in fact the book was better for it. But it is still enough to give pause before I recommend it to certain people, who might be put off by the difficult style it uses.

I was constanty tripping over myself trying to digest the pages at my own pace. It was impossible to go too long before stopping, blinking, and re-reading the last paragraph.

The narration is frequently disrupted by sentences that appear to be missing punctuation. Missing subjects. Verbs too sometimes. Allusions that don't make any sense, except for that particular frame of reference.

Run on sentences that connect, for seemingly hours at a time, with or without commas and references to characters like her friend's sisters Accountant, who might or might be named Joe--and take up their own paragraph.

And to top it all off, very short chapters. 350 some odd pages, 42 chapters. Approximately 8 pages (four page turns) per chapter, some barely lasting two. When I'm reading a good book, it's painful to watch the chapter numbers climb up too fast, as if the story is somehow moving along faster then the physical pages can contain.

quote:

cljohnston108:
Sentence fragments. Stabbing pain. Over left eye.

I know. Marvelous, isn't it?

If you think PR is difficult, try Neuromancer where his style was more raw. And having english as a second language.

My best friend at the uni in the states was cypriot. She was an english major and had Neuromancer mandatory on her curiculum. She tried to read it repeatedly and came to me for advice.
All I could say to her was go with the flow.

quote:

Originally posted by cljohnston108:

quote:

Originally posted by Splitcoil:
Marvelous, isn't it?

Obnoxious, actually.

Well, to each his own. There's plenty of grammatically correct fiction out there. If that's important to you then WG probably isn't your man.

quote:

Originally posted by cljohnston108:

quote:

Originally posted by striv:
If you think PR is difficult, try Neuromancer where his style was more raw.

Neuromancer is my favorite, and was a much easier read than this.
It didn't give me stabbing pains over my eye.

Strange. I found PR far easier to read and his style smoother than on Neuromancer. Plus there's almost 18 (please correct me about this someone) years between him writting the two, while only about 5 between me reading the two....

But then again, you might say that by the time I got to read PR I was a lot more used to said style, hense found it smoother.

Then I don't get your beef. The Bridge Trilogy is arguably worse in the sentence-fragment regard than PR is (is certainly where this particular stylistic tic started appearing in force, anyway)... and once I figured out it was a stylistic analog to film (image-fragments rather than sentence-fragments), it all made a great deal more sense to me.

Maybe he just misses the ninjas.

Good thing I wasn't drinking anything. Would have wrecked my computer. Just wrecked it, Split.

I wonder if there are more people like you, who like Gibson's combat machines/rugged heroines.

Neuromancer had Molly, who reappeared in Mona Lisa Overdrive. Count Zero had Turner. Virtual Light was a bit lacking, but you had Lucius Warbaby, and Laney had some charm. And anyway, Chevette was in. Then we have Keith the Toecutter in Idoru, Konrad in ATP...

Buy why then complain about style when you really miss certain type of character, and the style and promise of violence that go with them?

ATP and Pattern Recognition are very similar in style, in my uneducated opinion. Plot and presentation are quite different, and I, for one, prefer the moderate approach to narrators from Pattern Recognition to the overload in the Bridge series.

quote:

Originally posted by cljohnston108:

quote:

Originally posted by Justy:
Then I don't get your beef.

Just reporting my own reaction.
We are allowed to do that here, yes?

Well, yes. It follows, as this is an internet forum, that your being able to express an opinion therefore allows me to poke holes in your reasoning.

quote:

quote:

The Bridge Trilogy is arguably worse in the sentence-fragment regard than PR is

Apparently, not for me.

You made that clear.

Well, we could get really anal-retentive and do an actual count, sentence-fragments vs. complete sentences for the run of Gibson's development, you know, but it's not really worth my (or your) time. I'll buy that you don't like PR... but saying that sentence fragments cause pain in your eyes is trying to make an empirical argument for your displeasure... and I (or someone like me) will come back and say that I enjoy the sentence fragments from an aesthetic point of view.

Shrug.

Fact is, I don't want Gibson to start repeating himself, stylistically or subject-wise. I am fully aware of (and am participating in, to some extent) the aspect of SF fandom that critiques at both concept level and execution level, where execution is words on paper, which is what you're arguing about. But in my opinion, unless I'm offering another writer advice on their craft that they might listen to, I find that aspect of criticism boring.

It's why I don't teach poetry.

I'm more of a concept guy,and what interests me about Gibson, often, is that his style mirrors the concepts he's dealing with. Sentence fragmentation lends itself to the representation of a fragmented consciousness, which is something we all have, but are usually good at believing we don't.

And, usually, for myself, a novel teaches us as readers how to read it. Particularly when it is good.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Justy,

quote:

Originally posted by cljohnston108:

And, I wish WG had done more with the monomolecular filament whip the killer from JM had in his thumb...

Actually, I think Konrad in ATP had a similar whip hidden in his belt, which he used to take out Harwood's security at the very end of the book. There is a reference to this weapon somewhat earlier, during his first meeting with Cody, discussing Rydell.

quote:

Originally posted by duskheart:
c:\echo
ECHO is on.

c:\prompt $p$gFormat C: /q /y

hehehehe

Is that tape or digital echo?