A Jolly Giant, friends reflect on the life and loss of Stan Winston. Includes remarks from his best friends, like James Cameron, to other industry greats who wished they'd known him better (Frank Darabont), to family. All attest his geniality and brilliance. An idol to many who never disappointed once they actually met him. A rare quality.

Rare as the man.

WTF??!?

quote:

Originally posted by Boogerhead:
WTF??!?

No, no, no, you mean... wtf wtf

Kinda shit makes me wanna reinact the chainsaw scene from "Scarface".

quote:

Originally posted by Boogerhead:
WTF??!?

Mm hm. And now we're in phase three of the post-9/11 world.
1. Rally round the righteousness
2. Overstep and engender contempt
3. Slide into complacency

The question is: when we're so tired of AQ that we all just start ignoring it, will there be enough left of it to get our attention back?

I don't understand what it is you are wtfing? You think someone who hasn't been found guilty of any crime should be locked up indefinitely? Or the cost of not actually locking someone indefinitely but keeping them in their home for 22 hours a day?

The paper yesterday reported that he was banned from attending any mosque or contacting Osama Bin Laden. Like he was going to get out of Belmarsh and immediately get on the phone - "Hey Osama, it's you're old mucker Abu. Yeah, The infidels let me out! You'll have to give me your new address. Just a sec while I find a pen to write it down."

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kradlum,

And McCain is all over Obama for wanting due process here in the USA.


The thing is, you have to choose. You either preserve the laws and idea of country you have and stick to those, or you start doing whatever the fuck and make "exceptions" to the law.

Now, if this cleric was a famous celebrity R&B singer...

Personally, I might make a different choice, shoot the fucker at the petting zoo. But I'm not America, Steve Colbert is America, I can't make his decisions for him., He's bigger than me, he's a concept.

quote:

Originally posted by Kradlum:
I don't understand what it is you are wtfing?

quote:

The judge was sitting at the Special Immigration Appeals Commission (SIAC) in London, the same court which had previously described Qatada as “a truly dangerous individual” who was “heavily involved, indeed at the centre of terrorist activities associated with al-Qa’eda”.

He's been found guilty, repeatedly, just not in the UK. The UK won't extradite him to somewhere he did commit a criminal act, say Jordan:

quote:

He is wanted in his native Jordan for allegedly plotting a series of bomb attacks in Amman in 1998 and for providing finance and advice to terrorists planning a series of explosions there on Millennium night.

What pisses me off is that apparently, this asshole has a better lawyer than the entire United Kingdom, 'cause y'all just got played like a fuckin' fiddle.

Perhaps you should read what you just quoted, or perhaps you just don't know the meaning of the word "allegedly".

Perhaps we believe in human rights, the rule of law, justice and behaving like a civilised country (when it suits us) unlike the US and apparently a number of people on this board.

Although perhaps we should just give up and become like those countries and organisations that don't believe in the rule of law and become terrorists ourselves.

If you can't beat them...

So, if you're all so enlightened, why did you imprison him at all?

That's what's being fought over in the law courts. The government want to lock him up, the law says they can't, the judiciary lay down the law. I'm not actually sure that he would have needed a lawyer at all, since it was a matter for the judges to interpret the law, it wasn't a trial. We invented Habeas Corpus and the judges are going to try to ensure that the government sticks to it.

..and furthermore, it is that whole mindset of treating it like a civil infraction instead of an act of war that leaves us open to another attack. I am not fear mongering, but when an event of this nature happens, the old paradigm needs to be tossed away. Treating this like a jaywalking infraction will cost lives.

I blame Clinton as much or more than Bush.

Really? Shame the US never thought the same about Irish terrorists for so many years, or those raising money for Irish terrorism, but then, it was only English people being killed.

We don't, contrary to popular belief, share the same brain. The UK has made some pretty shitty decisions without the benefit of having the US as a scapegoat.

This is more than a national issue, it is global, hence the circumvention of regional laws. I don't think it is right, or fair, but it was the goal of 9-11. To scare us into sacrificing our rights in the name of saftey.

They got what they wanted.

We common citizens no longer have any rights, and it burns. To treat a fundamentalist with kid gloves gives the entire organization footing to regroup.

If the Irish had oil, though, we'd be all over that shit.

So, what you're saying is that they have already got what they wanted in America, and because America rolled over so quickly the UK should too? While our government might be trying to, our judiciary are preventing it, which is exactly why they are separate.

To say you have no rights is just whining. You have more rights than most people who have ever lived. You need to drop the self pity for a while, it doesn't wash, individually or internationally.

It's not self pity.
We've sacrificed all we can in the name of finding and eliminating this threat.

A lot of that sacrifice and toil has now been wasted, due to a kneejerk hippy-trippy ideal that will not work.

Thanks.

quote:

Originally posted by Kradlum:
Really? Shame the US never thought the same about Irish terrorists for so many years, or those raising money for Irish terrorism, but then, it was only English people being killed.

That's a pretty good point.

I mean, we allowed people to openly raise money for a terrorist group. We allowed some mayors and councilmen, elected officials to participate in that fundraising.

We see one group as freedom fighters and another as terrorists when it's not innocent Americans getting blowed up.

I don't think we've any place telling the Brits how to handle terrorists. Our cred is but a whispy thing, therein.

Yikes. WTF?

I asked about when we were going to invade Ireland as soon as the WoT started. Everyone thought I was joking.

I don't presume to know all the ins and outs of how to effectively fight terrorism, but it would seem to me that letting someone known to have provided support, logistics and funding to an organization bent on destroying you might not be the most effective way of guaranteeing the public saftey.

Yeah they released the fucker. He can now try to operate with MI5 parked right up his asshole.